1. Hello everybody! We almost received awards from MMOsite, remained the last spurt! Please, if you have not did it - vote for us
    Dismiss Notice

Armor specific gadgets

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Sahelanthropus, Dec 5, 2015.

  1. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    So I think that we can agree on the fact that light armor makes you move fast but gives you little protection, medium gives you avarge protection/ speed and heavy armor gives you plenty of armor but reduces speed. That's nothing new in the mmo world.

    My point is that we could try something different with that classic formula: Gadgets bound to armor type.

    For example, light armor can be combined with a jetpack or a cloaking device to make its user invisible. Medium armor could make use of.. Hoverboards or some sort of device that enhances the muscles to make you jump higher? And heavy armor.. Make it stronger than it is? (I simply can't come up with ideas now :/ )

    What I want to say is that I think that there must be some sort of unique equipement for every armor type to make it feel... Well, more unique. Because I know, I rather give up some movement speed/stamina regen to become a bulletsponge in heavy armor if there is nothing else to do with the other types.
     
    Pighead Elderberry and Vesta like this.
  2. NewbieGummi

    NewbieGummi Firestarter Founder

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2015
    Messages:
    133
    Likes Received:
    53
    Trophy Points:
    38
    There will be skills related to the armor type, which will make the whole difference between armors. And it will be more unique this way. Though, i like the idea of muscle enchantment for higher jumps, sounds amazing as an idea.
     
    Vesta likes this.
  3. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Skills =/= equipement.
     
  4. GlitchyGirl

    GlitchyGirl Inquisitive Golden Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I think that's what they are aiming for with the exo frames - to my knowledge heavy armor is going to have those attachement points that either A) allow you to trudge along with that arm and blade, or B) allow you to trudge along with that gigantic gun. And while that is not something that hasn't been done as much in MMO's it is indeed something that has been done in games such as Tribes 1,2, ascend and so on, or even games such as Infantry Online (if anyone remembers that >.>)

    As it is though to my understanding there is a difference. Heavy armor makes you more of an armor tank, but you have less of an energy shield, and this doesn't make as much a difference now. But it was my understanding that some weapons tear through the shield faster, while other tear through the armor faster.... think more along the lines of armor tanking , vs shield tanking in Eve Online.

    Not sure if I like armor specific gizmos and gadgets though, because then you fall back to the light scout, medium, assault, heavy bullet sponge that is in every type of game. While also limiting to... okay so this type of person has this type of armor so their loadout is going to be A, or B. Which could make pvp very cookie cutter. :x

    Maybe I could be completely wrong but that's my thought on it.
     
  5. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    For me, that is what makes most sense, I can't imagine a tank being mobile and dealing immense damage. It is indeed a fallback, but not in the mmo world, most mmo's Force you to play in a specific type of armor because it is bound to your class, you have little choice because you choose for it during character creation. Here in PG, you have the choice what you wear and whenever you want. My greatest fear is that light and medium armor will become "useless" compared to heavy armor. That is why I think, we must compensate somehow with items that make them feel more unique.
     
    GlitchyGirl likes this.
  6. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Imagine a battle between a heavy armored player and a light armored player, both same weapon and same aiming skills. The heavy will most likely win every time, a bit of extra movement speed will never help the light armored player to outplay the heavy (except if the heavy can't aim for sh#t, but that's irrelevant now). Now, imagine the light weight guy got a jet pack, I think the odds can change quickly here, try to hit someone who is spastic flying around.
     
    GlitchyGirl likes this.
  7. GlitchyGirl

    GlitchyGirl Inquisitive Golden Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    18
    And I can see that, however that's why I think medium armor would work well. Heavy is more in the type of raw armor, they take more physical damage. However their resistance to energy damage is nothing. Light armor is based around the idea of an energy shield that can take tons more punishement from damage, which may take armor down quickly. Of course they will suffer at the hands of those using ammo which affects energy armor. It all goes back to the shield tanking, v armor tanking.

    Medium armor will be that as the name implies.... happy medium! It will have some armor and shield to balance it all out.

    Now in your example, the heavy may not win every time... say they have the exact same type of weapon, and for that matter ammo and do the same type of damage. (Keep in mind! Different ammo and damage types are something that is planned!) If the ammo is the type that's going to do more physical than energy damage. Then the heavy is at a disadvantage - every - single - time. Due to the type of ammo used. (much in how energy tanks are a viable thing in Eve online, even if something has a bigger armor tank... the bigger armor tank wont win everytime due to damage types)


    Also quite honestly, at that point if you have a larger, bulkier and slower armor... go ahead and give them the jet pack. May help for lower things, but quite honestly for the most part outside of the most basic jumps or movements it will not be entirely practical for a heavy so it's use in combat would be quite limited. At least for the "fat" heavy guy.

    *edit: sorry it's early in the morning and I had to correct my horrible grammar!*
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2015
    Sahelanthropus likes this.
  8. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    True but, you should not forget that you can have multiple weapons, if you have one weapon that melts shields and a second one that pierces armor, then you have a solution for both situations, how you gonna help that? Further, if you play team pvp, some people can use energy weapons to melt shields while the others shred through the armor..
     
  9. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Ohh no no no, That's why I say Amor specific equipment, a heavy WITH a jet pack? **** No.
     
  10. GlitchyGirl

    GlitchyGirl Inquisitive Golden Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Right but that entirely depends on the range of the weapon. Say you have the handgun which does the energy weapon and the rifle which does the armor damage. At that point you would have the heavy person trying to constantly keep the light person in range (harder to do... speed disadvantage). Or if you reverse that and they have that rifle. The rifle can burn through ammo pretty quickly and if the light person does dance outside, or dances outside of the effective range of the heavy person (again easier to do because they are faster) It will result in the heavy being that much less effective.

    Again using the comparison that they have the exact type of weapons. Say hand gun is what does the energy damage, and the rifle is what does the physical damage. The heavy will have to get in close to do damage. (assuming identical load outs like your other example) While the faster, ligher person will be a) faster b) have a greater range. It doesn't sound as rosey for the heavy!

    Now yes , change the weapons and the damage around and the heavy may have more of a chance, but a smart light (I tend to play light classes myself xD) will just run them out of ammo by dancing outside of range and once that happens move in to kill them.

    As for groups though, at that point..... if you have group PVP and you have a group of people... you are going to have some people using heavy armor, you'll have people using med armor, you'll have some people using light. Or you may do what I was actually doing for a while and use a combination of med, heavy, and light (I wanted to skill all my armor skills xD) . Which does bring up a good point. What's to stop someone from mixing their armor types, or just from going with medium so they can have an all around armor type?
     
  11. GlitchyGirl

    GlitchyGirl Inquisitive Golden Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Lol I mostly tossed that in there for the laughs. Because the idea of a heavy with a jet pack just seems like a bad idea (and if its the same jetpack (same thrust etc) that a light can use, it would be useless to a heavy and would just look bad xD
     
  12. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Might work against rookies, but an experienced player will not brainlessly waste ammo on something he can't hit. And if you stay out of range that means that you can't hit him either. Only solution is to walk away as if nothing happened.
     
  13. GlitchyGirl

    GlitchyGirl Inquisitive Golden Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Exactly the point of the armor is to stay alive, and if at that point an experience player refuses to engage a player for one reason or another. It will allow the player, or even group of players to just harass and damage the player that refuses to attack them. (hit and run tactics) Now of course it such a situation in a more real life situation you'll have people whining that they are just being lame or abusing the game. But that's just the tears that come with PVP when someone is out matched due to their own choices in play style)
     
  14. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I don't know what to say to that, we are getting slightly off topic..
     
    GlitchyGirl likes this.
  15. GlitchyGirl

    GlitchyGirl Inquisitive Golden Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Sorry! I tend to do that some times. Back to the main point I was trying to make. Light, medium, and heavy armors will all offer their own unique ability to survive. This given with what they are planning already. There is no need to create an additional incentive to use one armor over the other by limiting the items that one can use when each armor already has a unique ability to survive against the other. That is what Im trying to say.

    Heck, already - due to the limited nature of speed and *weight* - you've already created a limiter as to what would be viable or not. For example the idea of a jet pack. The same jet pack on a light character, as heavy character would be useless for the heavy. Because the heavy would be to heavy to actually sucessfully use the jet pack in the same way the light could. (The heavy might be too heavy to even gain any lift from using a jet pack, and all it would do is just turn on when he or she tries to use it and it may not even provide any boost to mobility!)
     
    Sahelanthropus likes this.
  16. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I just don't like the idea that once my shield is down, I'll be easier to smash than a bug.. Without tools that help me somehow to outplay the situation.
     
  17. GlitchyGirl

    GlitchyGirl Inquisitive Golden Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Oh I can understand that. But that right there is the disadvantage to an energy tank. Just like it is in Eve Online... you may have a high regen shield tank, but once you crack through the shield - armor goes down almost as fast as the hull does. In the same way once you crack through an armor tank, the person is pretty much screwed. And what saves you is the ability to know when to run away xD

    But what you must know is that in the end, you are just trading one type of shielding that is good for one situation with another. Light gives you faster movement, more energy protection, more flexibility in what you can carry (again it was said that having a light armor will also affect everything else including inventory, or other types of weapons).

    Whereas heavy armor is going to give you a lot more out and out physical protection which will leave you limited against energy protection. While limiting your speed, limiting what extra stuff you can carry, and making you have to more likely commit to one type of role or damage, knowing that if you are in over your head... that option to run away simply isn't there.

    Whereas medium is going to give you that flexibility between the two of the roles. It's in the end something that ends about being about compromise and flexibility. Now keep in mind though, this is all just theorycraft.
     
    Sahelanthropus likes this.
  18. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    This ain't EVE, once your shield is down you have armor which can't be taken down unlike you stated, it will negate x% of the incoming damage. Where as the shield, once it is down, you are doomed with that few armor. Also, shields only regenerate after not taking damage for x seconds, and we all know how easy shields can be brought down. So stacking up health and armor will end up way more effective than having a big shield.
     
  19. GlitchyGirl

    GlitchyGirl Inquisitive Golden Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2015
    Messages:
    52
    Likes Received:
    44
    Trophy Points:
    18
    That is true, for now. But I was under the impression that as the game was further fleshed out and damage types where added. That one would start to see added durability to the shield (items will be tweaked to increase the shield amount to be on part with an, "armor tank".

    Maybe I misread that somewhere >.<
     
  20. Sahelanthropus

    Sahelanthropus Space engineer Founder

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2015
    Messages:
    91
    Likes Received:
    45
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Sorry I'm confused.. What?
     

Share This Page